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| | |-+  lets build a small engine gasifier??
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Author Topic: lets build a small engine gasifier??  (Read 56037 times)
slowspeed
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« Reply #135 on: December 01, 2010, 08:18:44 PM »

Well I built the one Luke made it did work think its called the G3
So I built a bigger one
have not tryed it yet
Looking for help   
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Working with Witte 15/1,WVO Lister 12/2 with 25kw Gen head,Gasifier,Sterling Engine,Solar,Hydrogen,300sd Benz on WVO,Dodge Truck on WVO
SteveU.
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« Reply #136 on: December 01, 2010, 09:19:26 PM »

Hi slowspeed/Jeff
I almost missed your "looking for help" underneath your picture.
If internally this has a LucG. inverted cone hearth I would suggest you PM Luc directly. A PM will forward onto his registered E-Mail to him. He has always been responsive to me.

If your build has a side jet modified Imbert type constricted hearth then the most helpful active group of DOer self builders is here:
http://victorygasworks.ning.com/group/thefabshop
84 helpful DOer fellows - you could be #85! You can read/view without joining. Open up the "view all" to see all of the Discussion threads.
They really like pictures too.

Or if you can show me pictures of the inside hearth configuration I could try and help out. Had my hands on three different Imbert gasifiers today and am working closely now on the engine side with one of the most active designer/builders.
We all learn from each other.

Regards
Washington State Steve Unruh


« Last Edit: December 01, 2010, 09:27:58 PM by SteveU. » Logged

"Use it up. Wear it out. Make do. Or do without."
"Trees are the Answer" to habitat, water, climate moderation, food, shelter, power, heat and light. Plant, grow, and harvest more trees. Then repeat. Trees the ultimate "no till crop". Trees THE BEST solar batteries. Now that is True sustainability.
slowspeed
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« Reply #137 on: December 01, 2010, 09:56:11 PM »

I found this one photo on my home laptop
got more at the shop
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SteveU.
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« Reply #138 on: December 04, 2010, 03:31:02 PM »

Hey Slowspeed - I been really busy - 12-14 hour days.
OK from you 2nd picture this is defiantly NOT a LUC type (dunce hat) inverted hearth design with the the restriction opening as a big outer perimeter "O" shape. What you have made so far is more an Inbert type. I have on-hands touched ~50 of these now and seen anothter couple of hundred in videos and pictures. Only about about a double handful of those have been capable for more than an "OH! Wow!"  YouTube video. So, the question I will not ask, but you must, is what you want this gasifier to do for you?
I will not ask what your fuel source is. I will not ask what your intended engine to be ran is. These are all primary starting questions you must ask yourself and then do the necessary reading and calculating to achieve engine running success. Links to all of this are in this thread imbedded/linked in the posts comments. If you are only willing to read one, read this one:
www.woodgas.nl   open up and load the "Microgasifiers" button. The pictures are nice, but the real design/operation info is in the words.

The very best first step to building one of these is to see, feel, hear one gasify fuel suppling an actual loaded engine gen-set.
Latest video showing this was posted up here:
http://victorygasworks.ning.com/profiles/blogs/daniels-video-on-gasifier-load
Yeah, have to join to view there. So What? That is the same here on MCG too. Visitors only get to see a percent of what we actual members talk about here too. Lurkers should never expect to get the same level of info as actual DOers.
Daniel the builder of this system does somewhere have a YouTube channel and may have put this video up there too. YouTube search out "Gasifier Load Bank Testing".
Great video. Shows him firing up his one year in development gasifier/filtering system and having it engine running in minutes to power a 22R SOHC Toyota overdriving a 25 hp motor to grid feedback in 70-80 amps. He started this gasifier/filter design set-up with a 2 cylinder lawnmower engine driving a 10 kW harbor Freight gen head.
This video will give you the sights, sounds and inspiration of what can be done by DOing and stick-to-itivness.
Also shows well for what you've built so far you are going next need to add into the lower housing between two of the nozzles (on the opposite side from your common air manifold inlet) a BIG 1 1/2 inch nozzle level combination Lighting/Poker/Viewing port. Most use a through the nozzle Tiny lighting/view port - makes it kinnda, difficult to use. And impossible to poker through.
With your large diameter lower housing forcing the nozzle tips so far out from the walls you are going to have to now add a tar fence underneath the nozzles so the engine gumming tar vapors cannot sneak/bypass behind the hot, hot converting planear burn zone just in front of the nozzles. With this as it is built so far you are also going to find you need to build up an internal slope cone from where the fuel hopper feeds in to just above the nozzles ends. This could hang down from your upper/lower housing seam line. You can read this described and line drawn pictured, and the why of it, in Dutch John's MicroGasifier article. This feed slope needs to be ~60 degree from a vertical plain to the nozzles then imagine this 60 degree line carried on past through the nozzles tips to the outside edge of the lower hearth reduction hole. Hearth reduction hole need to be sized based on the expected fuel gases flow rate as determined by the engine, the fuel type, and its chunked size.
AleseyA's USSR system pictures over on the "Wood Fuel Prep . . . " thread will show this 60 degree slope/alignment arraignment. No magic. No Vodoo. Just practical experienced based engineering. Just what has been found to be needed for this type of gasifier. Also the reduction hole material will need to be a sacrificial thick cast iron Easily Replaceable piece. Hottest part of the gasifier with the highest volumn of hottest gases and glowing char flowing through it. Even stainless and Inconal will melt erode here. On this flat floor plate type design this is called the choker plate piece. People are using cast iron nestle stacked brake drums or disc brake rotors here. A few fellows even using furnace cemented in cast bar bell weights here.

Now that you have welded in the the lower shelf plate what are you going to do below the plate for a needed reduction char stack forming/retaining bell or ring? What are you going to do for a reduction char stack hold 'em up grate? Grate also allows separating out the ash left on the surfaces of the gas converted char chunks so the char surfaces will remain actively exposed. Otherwise the reaction area will become "constipated".
How are you going to access these below plate areas and pieces for cleaning and replacement repairs?
AlexeyA. USSR pictures shows all of these experienced found needed features.

Regards
Washington State Steve Unruh

« Last Edit: December 05, 2010, 10:12:17 AM by SteveU. » Logged

"Use it up. Wear it out. Make do. Or do without."
"Trees are the Answer" to habitat, water, climate moderation, food, shelter, power, heat and light. Plant, grow, and harvest more trees. Then repeat. Trees the ultimate "no till crop". Trees THE BEST solar batteries. Now that is True sustainability.
SteveU.
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« Reply #139 on: March 16, 2011, 01:22:29 PM »

Hi All
I been waiting for a Complete small engine wood fueling system to surface that would fit under Mobile Bob's original specs of, "something . . . that (only) would cost a couple of hundred dollars. . . built up over a few of weekends . . . (even if) it only last a couple of hundred hours.
Fella named Phil C. has posted up a video of his system now up and running a 5kW/11HP genset in upstate New York. He made this up out of propane tanks, exhaust tubing, some cast iron and PVC pumbing parts. Video of it producing and running is here:

http://victorygasworks.ning.com/video/gasifer-with-venturi-scrubber

You may have to be a Victory site member to get this to load up -  I know a few here are. This has a YouTube icon on it. His name there is GetSomeBass1 and this is numbered 20110312075448 or could be searched out as "gasifier with venturi scrubber". My dialup providers no longer allow me direct YouTube access.
He says he never wants to be ice storm without power again. You can see the snow flying in the video. He says his first hearth reactor build-up was FEMA based and a "Tar maker" and he has now rebuilt it under Imbert principals.
Look this over and you will see it easily fits MB specs.
See that I have been saying: it ain't about majic, or a perfect scientific understanding. The gitter' done guys/welders/fabricators/wood burners are the ones actually out there DOing in woodgasification. His system no doubt doesn't make lab perfect/brainiac gas but with it's three step cleaner/cooler/washing system good enough for an IC engine fuel gas.
With these tough, tough steel propane tanks Phil C now has something he can fuel up and two hour run, twice a day for four hour of direct power or battery charging with minimal fuel prep and babysitting. See in the video back ground and he is using chunked up on site local hardwoods. A very practical fellow. You can see him in the video hand rodding down his fuel; hand heat testing his system; fine tuning his air/fuel gas mixer, etc.
My point is with what he has now he could get his two hour batches of power daily for a year and NEVER HAVE TO OUT SOURCH ANY FUEL. AND have the power to rebuild/replace his woodgas system out of Obtainium.
How many here can say this??
Any sharp eyes seeing the can of starting ether in the video and I can explain that.

Regards
Washington State Steve Unruh
« Last Edit: March 16, 2011, 01:42:24 PM by SteveU. » Logged

"Use it up. Wear it out. Make do. Or do without."
"Trees are the Answer" to habitat, water, climate moderation, food, shelter, power, heat and light. Plant, grow, and harvest more trees. Then repeat. Trees the ultimate "no till crop". Trees THE BEST solar batteries. Now that is True sustainability.
deeiche
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« Reply #140 on: March 16, 2011, 03:08:06 PM »

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« Last Edit: May 24, 2011, 07:39:59 AM by deeiche » Logged
mobile_bob
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« Reply #141 on: March 16, 2011, 05:33:22 PM »

there we are, a working system that is probably adequate for battery charging at the very least, and maybe stable enough for 60hz operation
as well?

i assume the ether is to get the engine running long enough to draw up the woodgas?

i like it!

bob g
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SteveU.
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« Reply #142 on: March 17, 2011, 06:55:36 AM »

Ha! Ha! Yep. You got it correct in one Mobile Bob. On a single cylinder four stroke especially with effective suction only occurring ONCE for ~60-80 degrees of a complete 2 revolution/720 degree cycle it takes a minimum of 4-10 complete revolutions to pull a properly mixed air/fuel gas through all of the tubing/piping from the filter/flare through the mixer into the engine cylinder. Not so bad on a hand flywheel cranker (CS Listeriod/Chagfaziod) but a real bixxx!! on a recoil/rope puller system. Electric starting is really a MUST with fueling with woodgas. And the starter better be able to hold up to definite 30 seconds up to 1 minute cranking cycles. Why on a buddies 5500 watt/8.5hp Briggs scream-a-matic set I front crank pulley converted it and flip belt crank it with a 900 watt 12vdc PM chainsaw motor to proof out his newest SS gasifier designs and develop my small engine woodgas mixers.
An open topped reactor system like Phil C. shows using or your Chinese gasifier stove need a lot of continuous suctioning to keep the fuel gasses flow going. Closed topped systems like I work with now will mildly pressurize and feed out fuel gasses once the suction blower to the proofing flare is shut off and the flare-off valve shut closed. THIS then over fuel floods out through the mixer with fuel gasses that have to then be engine cranking cleared out to establish a proper engine combustible air/fuel mix throug the mixer. Simple valved in Propane fumigation out of a 20 pound tank is much cheaper, cleaner and engine safer to get the engine up and running to do this than starting ether.
I still prefer the long electric cranking over cycle though.

Regards
Steve Unruh
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"Use it up. Wear it out. Make do. Or do without."
"Trees are the Answer" to habitat, water, climate moderation, food, shelter, power, heat and light. Plant, grow, and harvest more trees. Then repeat. Trees the ultimate "no till crop". Trees THE BEST solar batteries. Now that is True sustainability.
SteveU.
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« Reply #143 on: March 20, 2011, 06:25:25 AM »

Hey! Thanks for fixing the video Mr deelchi
With your sponsorship and at an early Sunday morning low Internet traffic time I was just able to get it down loaded and running in a record time of 35 minutes of out in the sticks (good gasifing fuel!) dial-up.
Regards
"out in the sticks" Steve Unruh
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"Use it up. Wear it out. Make do. Or do without."
"Trees are the Answer" to habitat, water, climate moderation, food, shelter, power, heat and light. Plant, grow, and harvest more trees. Then repeat. Trees the ultimate "no till crop". Trees THE BEST solar batteries. Now that is True sustainability.
deeiche
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« Reply #144 on: March 20, 2011, 07:00:33 AM »

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« Last Edit: May 23, 2011, 07:58:54 PM by deeiche » Logged
SteveU.
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« Reply #145 on: March 21, 2011, 10:40:38 AM »

Thanks for the thought Mr Deelchi
Although I live within two hours of an International airport (on a low urban traffic time) the last ten "Deliverance" type river road miles here to the north behind two ranged of mountain hills never made the old big dishes possible. Small dish stuff now works for downloading only but I only pay a monthly combo of $40. for dial-up phone and IPS combined now. Would add $1000.+ annual just to be able to high speed download only. This can buy a lot of metal/piping/welding and abrasive supplies for woodgas build-ups. AND I could actually survive a megatonner at the airport/highway/rail/port/urban center complex. Ha! Ha! Is a local joke having the regional Verizon satellite dish complex (with Shhhh! secret Federal emergency response center) literally in my backyard in this EMI/urban light shadowed valley. The not so secret Mt Saint Helens responce center is just a half mile over.

Phil C/GetSomeBass1 has put up a new video showing running his now pre-air heat revised system running for 4+ minutes. He shows more system details and shows wireless thermal scanning his different woodgas system componets:
http://victorygasworks.ning.com/video/gasifier-with-scrubber
Open it up and switch over to a YouTube viewing on the icon in the lower RH corner if you prefer.
He also has some mixer detailing stills photos up on the Victory stills picture section.

Regards
Washington State Steve Unruh

 
« Last Edit: March 21, 2011, 10:46:41 AM by SteveU. » Logged

"Use it up. Wear it out. Make do. Or do without."
"Trees are the Answer" to habitat, water, climate moderation, food, shelter, power, heat and light. Plant, grow, and harvest more trees. Then repeat. Trees the ultimate "no till crop". Trees THE BEST solar batteries. Now that is True sustainability.
deeiche
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« Reply #146 on: March 21, 2011, 11:55:37 AM »

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« Last Edit: May 23, 2011, 07:58:12 PM by deeiche » Logged
SteveU.
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« Reply #147 on: October 25, 2011, 08:07:11 AM »

Hi All
Here is some new small stationary woodgas fueling power generating results:

http://youtube.com/user/tritowns#g/u

13 short videos of the works of ArvidO. and TerryL. They are chipped wood gasifing now getting 3-5 hours 1.5-3kWe generated running time on a gasifier system based on the hearth principals of StephenA. He designs foe chipped wood fuels using downward sloped perimeter air jets and other special internal dimensioning.
The square lower insulating box, cooling and filtrations systems are all thier designs.
Also look over TerryL's three earlier Garden tractor gasifier system for a good view of the needed gasifier system components for IC engine fueling.

Enjoy
Washington State Steve Unruh
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"Use it up. Wear it out. Make do. Or do without."
"Trees are the Answer" to habitat, water, climate moderation, food, shelter, power, heat and light. Plant, grow, and harvest more trees. Then repeat. Trees the ultimate "no till crop". Trees THE BEST solar batteries. Now that is True sustainability.
dieselgman
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« Reply #148 on: December 25, 2011, 10:48:57 AM »

We have a large number of Industrial Natural Gas Listers (120) in the 25 to 35 hp range at our Kansas warehouse... these can all run perfectly as equipped on wellhead gases, natural gas, propane, methane and so on... it is a no-brainer for us to investigate the wood-gas angle. As time permits, we will be firing this project up - on wood. We also have a reasonably large resource in the waste stream in rural Kansas for things like pallets, tree trimmings, ag wastes and the like. Anybody have some industrial size shredders they want to part with? Any interested in helping kick this idea into gear? gary@dieselgen.com

dieselgman
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« Reply #149 on: February 27, 2012, 09:29:40 PM »

Hi,
I started building my first gassifier in 2009, and made a "tabletop gassifier" similar to Luc's G3-1 design mentioned earlier in this thread. After a couple of storm induced power outages last year, the recent rise in gas prices, and finding this forum, I am interested in gassification again and hope to run a motor this year.


Photo of the 2009 setup, experimenting with preheating air. (... and yes, there's a cone inside)

After reading this thread, I see more than a few things that I did wrong, or could have made differently to get better results. I have a couple of cones to try (4" base and 6" base), and have started two very different burn chambers as well. Anyone else working on one of these ?
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